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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
 Posted - 27/08/2008 : 05:42:56
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I am trying to use as much mulch as possible around our place to keep weeds down. There are a few areas of lawn or better expressed, that will hopefully be lawn.
One area is about 800-900 M2 and another is probably about the same. Small containers of local weed n feed is too expensive to kill the weeds. What do you suggest to spray/apply on these larger areas for the initial onslaught of getting rid of weed and then feeding the couch etc so I can establish the 'paddock' to become lawn?
Daniel
Happy Gardening
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Edited by - GardenDan on 30/08/2008 04:47:04 |
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Gail
garden sage
Australia
7707 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 08:30:35
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If there is one particular type of weed like broadleaf weeds, you can get selective herbicides but if you want you can go a more organic way, just takes a little longer. A lot will depend on the type of weeds though. A good couch lawn will out-compete most weeds. To do it properly start with aerating the soil if compacted, topdress with a light sandy type soil (skip these parts if already ok) then feed with a good lawn food and water regularly. When you mow, don't mow too short, leave the couch at least 3cm high preferably 5cm - you may have to mow more often for a while but thick grass will stop weeds. If the grass is fed regularly (follow the instructions on the pack for when) and deep watered regularly (once a week if no rain), the grass will thicken up and crowd out the weeds. It does take a lot of water though.
One thing that will really make the grass grow thick quickly if you can get it - litter from a poultry farm. When I did my first lawn from scratch, I spread some soil, dug up runners from my parents place and planted them every foot or so and then spread a small truckload of sawdust/chook manure mxiture from a friends poultry farm (raised meat chooks in big sheds). I spread the manure about 2 or 3cm thick over the whole lot, then watered. Within a few weeks I had a nice thick lawn. One downside - the manure stinks for a couple of days... only do it when the wind blows towards a neighbour you don't like  
Whichever way you do it, if you want a nice thick lawn it will need regular mowing, lots of watering and feeding every few months.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing not to use it in a fruit salad.
A ounce of common sense is worth more than a ton of intelligence.
Gail, near Gympie, Qld |
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Mary-Anne
garden sage
Australia
10809 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 14:11:09
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The best way to do it Daniel is with a little weeding tool, lift them up roots and all and they are gone.. If your weeds/grass is anything like mine.. Now I know you are going to say what weeds well that huge patch of couch I have does get those nasty broadleaf weeds occasionally and if my body wont let me hand weed then I spot spray with the cheap 1 litre bottle of no particular brand of Glyphosate from Bunnings or Big W $11 or $12 a bottle or paint the stuff on by hand..
Remembering weeds die quicker if they are feeding/drinking like spray them after the rain or a few days after they have been watered and fed..Another trick is to put spoonful of urea in the spray bottle so its a cheaper weed and feed..
Like Gail wrote if you have plenty of water go for it, if not well it a waste of time and money though Gail is spot on for keeping a lawn green.. Mind you I never feed my huge amount of couch and after the rain it looks great..
Friends are the flowers in the garden of life
Love Your Enemies... It Will Drive Them Nuts |
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Pamela
head gardener
Australia
3949 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 18:41:58
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I use a selective herbicide - I used 100 L of a new one called Kenta or something yesterday in my new sprayer trailer and that was certainly easy. It wasn't that expensive - about $18 and to make up 100L I used about two thirds of the bottle. It depends how much lawn you have and how many weeds - I have sooooo many and so many different types. This herbicide I bought as it attacks all the broadleaf as well as clovers and bindii. I will not use it for the horse paddocks as they love the clover so I will use Brush Off up there.
I have never had any success with Weed and Feed. I have also never fed my lawn and I do feel guilty so this spring I am going to apply some lawn food - the Produce Stores all have Shirley's no 17 i n stacks here so must be popular - and I am going to do what Gail says and keep my lawn higher this summer.
"The air of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears." |
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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 18:56:14
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The trouble is my current "grassy areas" are largely weeds with some couch and lots of bare dirt parts. The one out front is growing over the sub surface manifold of the HSTP so probably cannot aerate. I a appreciating the advice above. Thanks!
Daniel
Happy Gardening |
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Gail
garden sage
Australia
7707 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 19:31:13
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A lot will depend on your weeds. I don't have a lot of broadleaf weeds in the grass (plenty in the garden though  ) but do have a lot of grassy type weeds such as whisker grass (can't think of its proper name at the moment  , mullimbimby couch, broadleaf carpet grass plus a couple of different flat type spreading weeds (don't know what they are). Most of these types of weeds grow only where couch won't. Whisker grass grows on compacted soils (where the dogs run and play all the time), mullimbimby grows in a couple of wetter spots with poor drainage, the others opportunistic growers where there are bare patches in the good grass. Identifying the type of weeds will help in working out how to get rid of them. I'm actually trying to get more kikuya growing as it suits it here and makes a nice thick easy care lawn.
Start off by mowing it higher but regularly to stop the weeds seeding - even just stopping them seeding will eventually kill many weeds. It will take patience though. If you have a couple of good areas of grass, take a few small pieces out of that (fill in the hole that's left with some soil) and plant in the bare patches. If you weren't in a hurry, just do one smaller section at a time, it won't seem such a big job then. Also buy a big bag of lawn food and next time you get some good rain spread it around.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing not to use it in a fruit salad.
A ounce of common sense is worth more than a ton of intelligence.
Gail, near Gympie, Qld |
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Pamela
head gardener
Australia
3949 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 19:31:44
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I would spray with a selective herbicide and then plant lots of bits of grassy roots - couch if that's your wish and you can cope with its invasion of your garden beds - or a couple of squares of the turf you can buy for $5 a metre - a couple of strips will spread to cover once the heat rises - and lots of manure and stuff on top that you can get free - NOT tree mulch or similar as no grass will grow unless the latter has spent a year rotting down - I can still show you large patches where grass still will not grow from loads of tree mulch dumped there 3 years ago.
I am facing the same problem trying to get grass to grow on my new arena and the surrounding paddocks that the back hoe churned up - an area of 60 x 60 metres. But I do have some happy manure producers :-) with hooves and mouths to destroy the grass :-(
"The air of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears." |
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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2008 : 21:31:56
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I mowed last week on one section...and I kept it high, but it really is not that high anyway. It has ruts in the soil they placed over the HSTP. I reckon I can fertilise and perhaps sprinkle with my tank water - so long as I do not do it too much.
I do have some good portions of couch. I really do not mind which grass type remains there - I just want a green lawn. I will have couch, I guess, or something really nice in a small portion surrounded by concrete up near the house. A few years ago when I was mowing lawns to earn some $$$ I bought a cylinder mower (some people call them reel mowers). I will use that for the little lawn. The other larger areas are really just grass but I would like it to be reasonably nice, if that makes sense.
Daniel
Happy Gardening |
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Gail
garden sage
Australia
7707 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2008 : 05:26:41
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I know what you mean Daniel. To have a nice green looking area, rather than lawn, just feed 2 or 3 times a year (depending on what food) and a deep water when necessary - hopefully we will get fairly normal spring/summer rain - you will eventually have a reasonable lawn.
Here we will never have a great lawn but that does take a lot of time, effort and water, we just want to be able to keep the dust down and have somewhere soft for the kids to play on. Couch doesn't handle the dogs running on it and when we moved here we had a small patch of kikuya about a couple of metres square which did handle the dogs so when we have a bare spot we dig a few runners out and plant them in the bare spot. We now have a fairly large area and it is slowly spreading - just takes time... and regular rainfall helps as we don't water the grass except when we plant the runners.
Lawns in SE Qld will rarely look lush and green in winter because of the cold and dry.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing not to use it in a fruit salad.
A ounce of common sense is worth more than a ton of intelligence.
Gail, near Gympie, Qld |
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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2008 : 05:43:17
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Growing up we had kikuya 'lawn'. I know it has invasive runners etc but so long as you keep it under control it is a nice practical lawn. I grew it at a new home we built in Sydney - looked great. My neighbour had a couch lawn...he eventually gave up and had a kikuya lawn. :) I have no kikuya but there are other carpet type grasses that I would accept if they take over the front. They are around the back. At present there is enough couch in the front to hope it spreads. I will fertilise this weekend if possible. We may be busy with family stuff again, I am anticipating.
Daniel
Happy Gardening |
Edited by - GardenDan on 29/08/2008 04:54:36 |
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Gail
garden sage
Australia
7707 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2008 : 06:00:51
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I find it easier to keep kikuyu under control - it is easy to pull out unlike couch which gets into everything and is hard to pull up without breaking into small pieces  I just glypho around the garden beds to stop kikuya spreading where we don't want it
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing not to use it in a fruit salad.
A ounce of common sense is worth more than a ton of intelligence.
Gail, near Gympie, Qld |
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Pamela
head gardener
Australia
3949 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2008 : 06:41:13
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I agree with Gail and I like kikiyu the best but couch is damn well everywhere here. Years ago I paid a fair bit to have lawn made around my pool with wooden edges and lots of river sand to mix with the resident clayey soil there and then Turfco laid Sir Walter. There was no connection between this lawn and any other area with grass. Now it is Sir W (which dies off completely in winter - not a good look) and couch. And lots of clover but that is easy to kill. This geometric little lawn area for visiting children and adults to play on or sunbake was no where near other areas of couch in the front but the stuff spreads like mad when the sun gets going. A year ago I paid someone to dig out large sections of this lawn and to take wheelbarrow loads of soil up to the hill that had any signs of couch in it as I thought then there were just a few little sections and then I got a load of river sand in the ute and shovelled it into the holes and bought a couple of metres of Sir W (you can buy a square metre of it here all year for $8 a sq metre) and relaid on the bare bits. Then 3 weeks later, what do I see in the new sections but ... couch. As Gail says it is impossible once it gets into a garden bed. However I have discovered a wonderful herbicide called Fusilade that is expensive but valuable as it only kills grass - couch, kikiyu - any monopod I think it is called and so you can happily spray your garden beds of roses etc that are specially sensitive to glypho.
Sir W is fantastic for areas that are shaded and I am slowly doing what Gail is doing and digging out bits with roots and planting them up on the hill under the gum trees where it has taken off wonderfully. The horses seem to like eating it too and it doesn't get as high as kike but spreads just as rapidly.
"The air of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears." |
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Mary-Anne
garden sage
Australia
10809 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2008 : 08:17:27
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We have been slowly killing off some grass that looks like kikuyu down the back for years we actually dug up a huge part of it as we preferred the couch then maybe it was buffalo how can I tell it apart. 
Because if it kikuyu Daniel you are very welcome to it..
Friends are the flowers in the garden of life
Love Your Enemies... It Will Drive Them Nuts |
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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
Posted - 29/08/2008 : 18:38:24
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Thanks Mary-Anne but at the moment I think I will stick with the couch - it seems to be hanging in despite all that has happened here over recent years. It is very patchy and in the back yard a type of carpet grass is taking over. In both those areas my main intention is to get things green. I have just been out the front and spread fertiliser. I hope for a light shower tonight - oh well...it is worth the hope.
Yesterday Kerrie and I drove out the drive...a very dry drive...and drove a Km down the road where it was raining. The whole lot missed us and went by so close. We were please to get a little last night though. Our house tank is empty and being fed from town water at present.
Daniel
Happy Gardening |
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Mary-Anne
garden sage
Australia
10809 Posts |
Posted - 29/08/2008 : 20:57:22
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Yes I think couch is the best Daniel.
And it wont take long to cover a area in the wet season..
Friends are the flowers in the garden of life
Love Your Enemies... It Will Drive Them Nuts |
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GardenDan
gardener
Australia
836 Posts |
Posted - 30/08/2008 : 05:03:04
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Oh well, no rain last night it seems. Might have to get the other tank into action today. I have been saving the water in that tank for the garden, as in flowers and shrubs.
Pamela, earlier you wrote:
"I use a selective herbicide - I used 100 L of a new one called Kenta or something yesterday in my new sprayer trailer and that was certainly easy. It wasn't that expensive - about $18 and to make up 100L I used about two thirds of the bottle. It depends how much lawn you have and how many weeds - I have sooooo many and so many different types. This herbicide I bought as it attacks all the broadleaf as well as clovers and bindii. I will not use it for the horse paddocks as they love the clover so I will use Brush Off up there."
Can you tell me more about "Kenta"? I googled it and found nothing relevant. How did it go? Too early yet to say? And "brush off"? (Although I remember that as something else during my high school dating days :)
Daniel
Happy Gardening |
Edited by - GardenDan on 30/08/2008 05:10:34 |
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